Old Mutual On The Money
Old Mutual On The Money
Retired footballer Thandani Ntshumayelo, chats with John Manyike about the financial pitfalls pro footballers face
The life of a footballer seems perfect – adoring fans and a big salary. But for many, fame and fortune are fleeting without the financial knowledge to manage their money wisely. Retired footballer Thandani Nsthumayelo chats with John Manyike, our Group Head of Financial Education, about the lifestyle’s financial pitfalls and costly mistakes. Don’t miss this eye-opening glimpse into the realities of footballers’ lives.
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John Manyike 00:00:05
Welcome to Old Mutuals, “On The Money Show”. We’re glad you could join us again. We have a special guest today, uh those of you who know him, call him “Bibo” Yes, “Bibo”! A very well known soccer player renowned for his abilities as a defensive mid-fielder and that’s none other than, Thandani Ntshumayelo.
John Manyike 00:00:32
I think maybe a lot of people they know you from the pitch, I mean in your playing days you used to play soccer, um but maybe lets take it a bit er backwards. Where were you born, you know, how you grew up and your surroundings. Lets take it from…(gestures to guests childhood).
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:00:51
Um, my name is Thandani Ntshumayelo, known as “Bibo”, the nickname I got from the Bibo juice. I used to like that juice when I was younger.
John Manyike 00:01:01
Oh I was wondering…
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:01:05
From the juice, before I go for training, then I would drink it, so one of my friends then called me “Bibo”.
John Manyike 00:01:16
And did the brand give you something for being called Bibo?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:01:16
Not really, because that time when I was playing, I think maybe, I don’t know maybe we were not maybe wise to go ask for these things. But like Thandani is from Phiritona in Heilbron, I was born and raised there and I left home at a young age to Suspersport Academy. I think I left when I was 15 or younger. Um, to pursue um my dream. Obvious it was difficult to leave your parents at that age, but it was something that I wanted and I just had to do it.
John Manyike 00:01:50
So your name Thandani, and your surname is Ntshumayelo, it sounds like it was a very religious family?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:02:02
Yoh that’s a good question and my family like my father prays like every minute and we grew up there even my granny. I’m from a very, very spiritual family, we pray. Christian family and I’m happy the way they raised me, I have no questions why other things happened in my life, like they raised me very well.
John Manyike 00:2:30
You had siblings?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:02:32
Yes I have a little sister, she’s 21 or 20 I’m just not sure.
John Manyike 00:02:39
Were you ever married?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:02:41
No I was not married, but I stayed with the mother of my child. We stayed for long, but we broke up but now were co-parenting our son and it’s part of life.
John Manyike 00:02:59
And possibility ya di love back?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:03:00
Ja, I would love to, I would love to
John Manyike 00:03:02
Does she know though?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:03:02
Of love back? No sorry not love back like, I think I see everything now that everything happens for a reason and if it happens, it happens. But like I also wanna be married, I wanna be married, I wanna raise a family of my own with my wife and I’d love that. And I think now I’m more um, I don’t wanna use matured. I’m more wiser on things that can maybe jeopardize whatever that I have to leave. So I’ll be able to look after my family.
John Manyike 00:03:39
So you played for Black Swallows, before you turned professional. How were you discovered by these big clubs?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:03:47
I was meant mina, I was meant to go to, there was an academy called Harmony in Free State in Virginia, Molefe Ntseke was the technical director at Kaiser Chiefs he was the one that spot. They wanted me to come and play for the academy and there was trials again for Supersport. And my father said to me, lets go try Supersport, they were in Bethlehem, and then you’ll choose which one maybe you’ll go to. And then, then I went for Supersport in Bethlehem, there was like 500 kids if I’m not mistaken but I didn’t know that they’re only looking for one player, out of 500. So I’m midfielder, so there’s strikers, defenders but they’re only looking for one, so it happened to be me fortunately and I was so happy. But it was a tough, tough road for me as much as people saw how I fought for everything. I fought for everything in my life, for whatever that I have because of I was competing with more talented players than me but I had believe in myself and I believe in working hard and that’s why I achieved some of the things that I’ve achieved in my life.
John Manyike 00:05:17
Isn’t is ironic Thandani hore, you went for trials, there were 500 kids, they were looking for one. At some point before you became a human being you were a sperm and you were competing with millions and you made it. Doesn’t that say something about you though?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:05:45
Strange but nna since ke hlaaha, since ke hlalefa, I always knew that I’m going to be a footballer. Because at school, you know at school they would ask you, ‘What do you want to be?’ I’ve never, I’ve never said a doctor I’ve never said a teacher, I’ve never said what. I always knew that I’m gonna be a footballer. My late grandmother told my, told my father, coz my father ke motho wa di buka, my father’s someone that wants us to study and what what, but my granny said that they must just leave me to play, coz I used to kick the ball inside the house, break windows, but my granny is the one that bought me the first pair of boots. She’s the one that, she also believed that I’m gonna make it in football.
John Manyike 00:06:37
So you made it to the first team, ya Supersport, after you know playing ko academy and then later on Pirates, Orlando Pirates recruited you. You have two or three caps, Bafana Bafana caps. You were a rising star, I mean you were playing alongside big players at Orlando Pirates I remember at one stage you were playing with Andile Jali. If you were not put in, it would be Jali because you had similar play styles. But just when we were expecting more, then something happened. What went wrong?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:07:18
You know like, I don’t know how to say it, but that’s what I said earlier, that I’ve fought, I’ve fought for this career. Even from the academy, the talent that I was competing with was Kamohelo Mokhotsho, who played in Europe, Thato Keke, Kemit Erasmus and the most talented player I’ve seen its Zongo, Masibusane Zongo, he’s talented. But the first team coach chose me, before those players. Then when I get to the first team, I get to compete with international players, Siyabonga Nkosi, Hlompho Kekana to name a few. I won the battle, I played almost every game. My first season we won the league, we won the league and I pushed myself with discipline and I was so disciplined where I was not even drinking alcohol, I was not into girls and then I get to Pirates. At Supersport, yes I was Thandani, I was playing, I was beating, we would play Pirates we would beat them 3-nothing but nobody talks about who you play for. You play for Supersport. It shows these big clubs they have something, I don’t know what is it, they have big clubs. Because once you just sign, just for signing for Pirates and they made me a press conference. People don’t know that, people don’t remember that. I’m one of the few players that Orlando Pirates made a press conference for. It was Benni McCarthy, Okhonkho and myself only. And I took those things light, that how the chairman, like feel as a player, like how he respected my work. And then I get to Pirates, everyone knows Thandani, the money goes up, signing on fees, bigger.
John Manyike 00:09:37
How much was it?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:09:37
The signing on fee? Let me say, at Supersport it was… Supersport when we won the league I got two hundred and forty and I was eighteen years. I got two hundred and forty we won the league.
John Manyike 00:09:54
What year was that?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:09:54
2009. Towards 2010 we won the league for the third time. So I got two hundred and forty, I’m eighteen years old, my father is at school so no one is advising me with money.
John Manyike 00:10:14
And what was your monthly salary?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:10:14
Monthly salary was I think fifteen thousand. Fifteen or less.
John Manyike 00:10:18
This was which club now?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:10:20
Supersport. Yes I want to show you how it jumped. I’m at Supersport, I’m earning fifteen thousand, but I didn’t know that if you win the league you’re gonna get a lumpsum. Like a signing on fee. Because I had just signed from the academy. We won the league, then in my account was two hundred and forty. I didn’t even know that we were going to get that money. Then I got to the bank. I remember I was still using a debit card from FNB and that time I didn’t know that the reason why you signed at the banks. So today I would sign like this tomorrow I would sign like this and now there’s two hundred and forty in my account and ke batla ho withdraw ten thousand. They check my age, they called the manager. ‘What do you do?’ ‘I am a footballer’. They verified and checked then I knew that I must stick with one signature. Then I called my dad and told him, I got that money. And it was someone who never, my father is someone who would never believe that football would will, you’d like live on football. He always knew that school you’d be ok. But football from then he saw that there’s money in football. And then he wanted to go to school to go do medicine. And I personally told him that he can go to school, I’ll pay for him. And then I did that.
John Manyike 00:11:56
So your father was studying medicine and you subsidized the costs?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:11:58
Yes then I paid. Then I get to Pirates. When I get to pirates, my agent called me. My agent was Tim Subazi. I was playing, I was playing well like… he said at Kaiser Chiefs they wanted to sign me. I was excited, I love Chiefs, I wanted to go to Chiefs and then later, I don’t know what happened with that deal, and then later on the day we ended up going to Parktown. We went to Parktown.
John Manyike 00:12:33
You were going to Naturena, jiki-jiki and now Parktown?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:12:36
I Didn’t even know, I just thought that when you leave one team , you just leave. So I don’t know what happened, my manager. [JM: You didn’t have an agent that time?] I did, it was Tim. I left everything with him because I trusted him.
So he got me a good deal at Pirates. When I got to Pirates (I had to, all of a sudden) do a press conference. I do the press conference. When I left supersport I was earning fifteen thousand a month, at Pirates sixty-five. It was a big jump. [JM: WOW! From fifteen to sixty-five?] Ya the signing on I think was six hundred or five hundred. But at that time I wasn’t focused on the signing on fee, as long as my salary (moved) from fifteen. Life changed now. When I get to Pirates, I bought a property in Broadacres. Theres one thing I’d always (JM: This was a bond?) yes a bond. Theres one thing I’d always respect about Tim Sukazi, he always helped us, he did his best, he negotiated good contracts for us. Your Mashigo’s, your Elias Phelembe. If you check those players, Thuso Phala, we all had houses. If you signed a big contract, you bought a house. Most of us were staying this side, we were staying close to him so he made a support system so he made us to be closer. We were staying this side, I think I was 22, then I bought that property. I was with Pirates, staying alone, my father is there, my mother is there. (14:23: JM: Freedom!) Freedom, money and were starting to be recognized by people. I don’t want to say, but people who loved (foot)ball would know that I could play but you then (also) start to attract banyana. You dress well, you’re young you have money and a nice car. You stay in Fourways and I would say like, then I, I did something man (14:57 JM What happened?) And then I get to Pirates. I’m not crying because of what happened I’m getting emotional, I’m crying from how hard I worked and sacrificed to play in that team, Pirates. There was Andile Jali, there was Oupa Manyisa and I remember even that night, when I had signed with Pirates, I was like where am I going? And then people will tell me like you know you killed your career. At Pirates you’re not gonna play and what. I told myself, I’m gonna play and that I need to work hard. After training, I’d train extra. I’d sleep on time you know. Just for me to prove to myself and to prove to people (that) I’m gonna play. And Andile, Oupa, machines. Even I saw that no, but I had this thing, I was stubborn. Even now, when I want to do something, if I put my mind into it, I’ll achieve it. And then I went there. And I was like first day, first day when I get to Pirates, I was sponsored by Nike, I was sponsored by Nike that time. When I get there, Andile was sponsored by Nike. So when you get to Pirates, if you not sponsored, you’re not supposed to wear, they give you boots tsa Addidas so they didn’t know I’m sponsored because that day, maybe they didn’t think I can be sponsored, I don’t know. Then they made me to change the Nike boots, I must bring the contract. Then I said no its fine, I’ll bring the contract. Brought the contract. I have a contract with Nike. Then the respect starts to change, that this guy. Mind you, I’m from Supersport who’s beating these people, I’m the league champion, they haven’t won the league. So I fought. I fought, training, fight, sleep, doing everything right and then I played ko Pirates. I pushed. And then now they playing 4-4-2 they can’t take Jali out, they can’t take Oupa out and I’m pushing. I want to play le nna. They changed the formation, they made it 4-3-3 all three of us we played. We played, we went to Africa, we won leagues we won cups, neh? Playing, all of us.
John Manyike 00:17:29
So imagine changing formation to accommodate a talented player like yourself.
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:17:34
But its not a favour, I’ll tell any young player, if you want to achieve something, if you want something, let them fight balebang, but le wena you need to fight for yourself. And I did that. And, and, and then ka e senya ka ntwe e stupid. Stupid, stupid, stupid. And then like now another thing that like people ha ba e understand, they just talk from outside, until ho e yetsa o tla bona. Theres nothing nice ska motho o rekellang, wa bona le ba ngata joang ha ona ntwe e nice to buy everyone alcohol. (18:14 JM: So that’s what you used to do, you’d say fill up the table) ko ntlong yaka I’m staying alone, hakena mosadi. I don’t even know motho o mo one. He's from Soweto, he’s wearing my shorts, o ko ntlong yaka, I have to go to training, there’s people in my house. Theres girls. There’s people that I didn’t even know. At Nike I had like maybe 60 sneakers. I don’t even know di fella kae.
John Manyike 00:18:42
Where they sponsored or were you buying them?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:18:42
Sponsored. You get everything for free. (18:44 JM: So friends come and when they go?)
You date ngwanyana you take her to Nike, buy whatever. Because they think at that time, they thought I’m the one buying, so they didn’t know that its for free. And then you lose it. Ka mo, at Pirates, they were not fair , like they know everyone from Pirates they were not fair. Sometimes theres games like that you need to, you want to play. They don’t play you, they play someone. Its stressful. People don’t understand. Footballers they go through a lot. Its tough. It's very, very sad hore you train hard, you sacrifice (19:19 JM: And then you’re not selected) You’re not selected, but you know that you’re supposed to play.
John Manyike 00:19:25
Did that work on you mentally that, you train hard
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:19:29
And I’ve never said it. I’m starting to say it today, that I see, I look back where it went wrong. And because now my mind is, I’m ok now. I went to therapy and thank you guys for inviting me after this because now in the other ones I was talking about this, I was crying. You don’t even know why you’re crying, you’re thinking of your car that you lost, not thinking Bophelo.
John Manyike 00:20:11
So, so at the time when you’re staying alone always hosting parties, did that mean you have to buy alcohol, buy things for everyone?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:20:19
I go to training, I leave one my friends with my card (20:23 JM: So you leave your bank card?) Bank card, I had a private wealth, these are the black ones. (20:34-35 JM: So this friend would do what with the card?) They would buy alcohol, buy food for everyone. Ha ke kgutla training, everyone o monate.
John Manyike 00:20:43
So in other words, this friend had a pin
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:20:45
Two, three friends of mine had my pin.
John Manyike 00:20:48
Imagine, three friends with your bank pin or even more.
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:20:52
These other girls had pin yaka
John Manyike 00:21:00
So how would you monitor balance hore ho setse bokae if everyone had your pin?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:21:02
There’s one thing about footballers, you get money easy, chelete e kena quick. Imagine if we’d saved that money? For example, we go play MTN8, we don’t even think of eight thousand. Now you have eight thousand, you’re man of the match
John Manyike 00:21:15
So while you are playing, did you ever default on that bond ko Fourways?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:21:17
Never. (21:20 JM: You would never default that, you were always paying?) Never an issue. Now at school, my father’s at Meduna, paid. We had a farm ko hae, paying on time. I had a car paying on time. Ngwana ko hae, o kena multiracial, paying on time. My mother? (I) Sent money. It was difficult, I’m not saying I was earning much, no le nna I was doing those things because I wanted that life, I was pushing harder so I can maintain that life. I don’t blame someone who buys a car. Its yours, you work hard you know? Don’t forget that I also had my life ke rata dintho, ke reka di Diesel. So can you imagine, that time in a month after all the bills are paid, how much do you have left? And it’s the 5th (of the month)
John Manyike 00:22:12
And you must wait for the end of the month?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:22:12
No, no. I didn’t have credit cards, so I called Bra Tim. The most reliable person. I call Bra Tim, ‘Bra Tim, there’s money in my account’ (00:36 JM: Was that an investment account?) Yes when you had extra cash, they would put it away for you and leave just your salary. Then I’d take twenty thousand. Or I’d call Sbongile. Sbongile worked in the office, after 15 minutes (would transfer) twenty thousand. And you don’t need that twenty thousand.
John Manyike 00:22:53
So technically you were accessing your investment account to fund this lifestyle?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:23:00
And that time it wasn’t bad, at that time. Because I was not into drugs that time. It was alcohol and girls at the time.
John Manyike 00:23:07
Let’s talk about the drugs thing, how did it start?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:23:09
It started like, it started like this thing where you think you know yourself. You know that thing? Because I used to see people doing them, but I was like, I would never do these things and that’s one wrong thing. If you see people doing that, stay away. Just stay away. Because some of the guys, you would see a guy who’s driving a Ferrari, he’s staying ko Dainfern, he’s smoking these things and you’re thinking hayi maan (these things won’t harm you). That’s how you think, but forgetting hore wena, you are a footballer, you got to rest. You need to rest. Those things don’t let you rest number 1.
John Manyike 00:23:58
So when you started using drugs and playing soccer, where you starting to believe it was giving you extra strength?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:24:12
Yes. Sometimes I would get injured and for long and get frustrated. So I’d usually get injured and I’d be out for almost 4 months, sometimes 6 weeks. And bona batho ba, they don’t even encourage you to start doing your rehab, if you’re hurt, you’re hurt and you stress about it. So like now these things make you forget, you end up calling a girl. Tomorrow morning, you’re still injured. So you carry on taking them. The nice thing, the money is still there, but you’re not playing. When you’re not playing, you’re not making money in football. Your contract comes to an end, you can’t demand more because you not playing.
John Manyike 00:25:03
So, they drugs continued, how much, how did this drug affect di finances tsa hao?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:25:14
A lot. Because, I won’t mention names but there were a lot of (guys) that took drugs with me. They still take drugs, but I won’t mention. They still take drugs. I learnt the hard way. I thank God for that. It was painful but I think it was necessary for me to go through that. You spend. Drugs make you lie. You lie to your father, you lie to your mother. You become clever. O bua maka a mang. You end up lying to your mother about the drugs you take (that cost five hundred) then tomorrow morning, you regret it. So all the guys smoke, but I don’t know what your impression of me is?
John Manyike 00:26:11
So how were you caught by the club?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:26:25
We were out smoking, I think I was not in the team, I’m gonna say it again, I was not in the team. I remember I was not in the team. (26:39 JM: What do you mean you were not in the team?) I was not in the 18, so let me go smoke. They called me and asked me to come to the camp. But I’m not thinking, I’m tired. I smoked and drank last night and I’m tired. Let me go, because I knew that from the 18, I’m going to be on the bench. When I got there, we trained that evening, tomorrow it’s the first 11 (27:13 JM: You were not expecting to play?) But Anyway, I thought I was playing. I remembered that day. I remember it was raining the 09th. The 09th of February, we were playing Platinum Stars, I remember that day. I think I knew it was my last game, I don’t know. I’m a rough player, I don’t go over the board, but I’m tough. But that day I was like a lion. Tackles that you never see. And then after game, then I see, I got substituted, but they know I always play like that. They took me off. Because of like I’m taking drugs, I drink, I can’t maintain 90minutes. They know Bibo. The Bibo we know is tired after 60 minutes? What’s happening with Bibo? But they don’t know. Bibo comes to training on time, Bibo is clean everyday. Then I see the doctor. I remember that guy, he was short, I forgot his name. He came towards me, I was on the bench. I saw him, because normally when it’s doping they tell you, that guys today its doping. So if they told me then I’d know that on the ground I’d make myself fall, so I could get taken off or by ambulance. But it never happened, but fine. They called me, and told me I would have to do a urine test. I haven’t thought about the drugs. Plus it was not the first time being tested in my career. So I go, I remember I was the goal keeper. If it wasn’t Senzo Meyiwa, it was Mpontjane
John Manyike 00:29:05
Konje you were in the same team with Senzo?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:29:10
Ya it was between Senzo or, but it can’t be Mpontjane because of Mpontkane was at Platinum Stars or he came to us? I can’t remember, but he was the goal keeper. So I took time to pee, it took long. Then after I pee’d I asked the guy, how long for the result to return? That guy said 3 weeks. So that’s the longest 3 weeks of my life. The longest 3 weeks of my life. So I’m thinking like, I see my life, you see when you see that your life is over? That picture of the house going, the car going, my mother and father will know? It’s over! You see? Three weeks passed. Oh 3 weeks but the results haven’t arrived. Another month. A month gone. Ke monate. So I’m thinking they didn’t pick up the drugs in my system. But I didn’t know. They already have my results and then, I wanted to leave. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying Pirates did that. But I’m saying I wanted to leave Pirates to go to Wits. Wits, coach Gavin Hunt was the one coaching Wits. I wanted to go to Wits. The money was good, (that) they were gonna give me. But I don’t think the club knew the money was good, they just knew that I just want to leave because I was not playing. I told them that I cannot be on the bench to watch Selzar play. Sorry to say that but, he knows, I used to tell him that he can’t play before me. I used to tell him.
John Manyike 00:30:54
Who was the coach at that time?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:30:55
It was Eric Tinkler and Tebza. But my behaviour had started to change. At training. I’m always moody. I’m a fun guy, they know I make everyone happy. But they always see, sometimes, I get irritated because I used all my money. I go in, I change and leave after training. So they start to see, why is Bibo this way? And then I got caught, the chairman called my manager and told him that there’s something they need to discuss, I must come to the office.
John Manyike 00:31:41
You didn’t suspect anything that time?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:31:42
Ya but I went to the office and they showed me the results and they were like you are gonna be suspended from Pirates until I need to take this thing, I need to take sample B to be tested in Qatar. Story now.
John Manyike 00:32:07
Then newspapers?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:32:08
No not yet. We still waiting for the results that have to come back from Qatar. You do two tests. They just have this one and they’re going to make sure with the one test done in Qatar. So Tim asked me, do you do drugs? Because he didn’t suspect anything. But he recalls that Bibo has been asking for money now and then, now and then you see. So he recalled that. When I (Tim) need Bibo, Bibo stays like 2 minutes (away) he stays there I stay here. Bibo, come watch the game. But now you can’t get a hold of Bibo. When he gets to the gate, he can’t even get into my house because I’m not there. You can’t even call me. Tell them I’m not around. Nobody would just enter. But that’s when he put it together and I told him that I was not happy and playing the victim. I trusted him, how he thinks, with the law, Tim was a partner at Bowmans. I thought he would find a loophole somehow. Bra Tim sent someone else. And I didn’t have hope, like where to from here. I can’t to tell my father because he’s writing, he’s happy that he’s passing and now. At home they didn’t even know that I’m suspended from Pirates.. Pirates played the final for Nedbank, and they wondered why Bibo wasn’t in the team. Bibo is suspended, until those results return and then its going to be public. So my mother heard on the radio.
So people were guessing, who could be this player that got suspended in the drafts? Remember it came up? (34:29 JM: I remember.) No one even thought of me. I remember talking to my mother, she wondered who it was. And in my heart I felt that I had disappointed my mother.
John Manyike 00:34:48
So the news hit the newspapers, the media? What was happening?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:34:54
My parents find out ko radio that its my name. So my father came. I want to be a father like my dad. I want to father my kids like my dad. And then he came. He came, I remember he came he was like no, don’t worry, we going to be fine. You are going to be fine. You looked after us when you were playing. I’ll pay for the house, if you want to keep this car I’ll pay for it. I was driving a CLA at that time. If you want to keep it, I’ll pay for it, ill pay for your house. I’ll look after you, don’t even think about killing yourself.
John Manyike 00:35:46
Did your father finish the medicine?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:35:46
Yeah that time he was not working he was doing his community service. He was getting paid a little in Mafikeng. So when my father said that, I thought to myself, this man doesn’t know what we’re talking about here, the lies. Maybe my father didn’t realise how big it all was. He didn’t know but my father didn’t tell me, he didn’t even cry. Don’t worry, don’t even kill yourself, don’t even think of that. But in my mind I’m think when he leaves here, I’m going to find a way how to kill myself.
John Manyike 00:36:18
So you’re having suicidal thoughts?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:36:23
Ja. Because in my mind, I’m thinking so. It’s easy here. In Fourways, you can stay in your house for long and no one comes to check, saying they were passing by. Theres no such thing. So that’s when my, my ex-girlfriend, the mother of my child was there. She was there. I’ve disappointed her, don’t forget, I’ve disappointed her cheated on her with prostitutes, with girls, with what, what. She like, she knew that I loved her but didn’t understand why this person is like this? She doesn’t understand now that I’m on drugs you see? Sometimes when she came to visit me, she doesn’t understand where these things come from. No but like she stayed with me. My parents they were there for me. That’s when I saw that in life you only need your parents. You only need your family. I will tell you that. I saw it with me. Those people that were full in my house? (37:36 JM: They disappeared?) Gone. Gone I don’t blame them.
John Manyike 00:37:39
So this thing is true, that when days are dark friends are few?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:37:40
I use that phrase in my life. I saw it. That’s how it is. But I don’t blame them.
John Manyike 00:38:47
But hang on a sec, from the suicidal thoughts, did you get counselling?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:37:54
No listen to the story. No I’m like, I was not like deep, deep into drugs. So you have this mind that, I’m not a junkie. People think that junkies are people that, or not junkies, people that take drugs are people that are dirty. No. you can be clean. I know doctors that take drugs I know lawyers that take drugs. You think you’re controlling the drug but now, I’ve lost my job. I’m withdrawing my monies, with the mind to deplete it all. And when it’s all finished, I’ll kill myself. And then my girlfriend is like, I’m pregnant. Huh?? How?
.
John Manyike 00:38:42
How are you asking how, because you are entering?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:38:44
I’m asking myself, pregnant how, when I’ve lost my job? When the money wasy available you didn’t get pregnant. Now you’re pregnant?
John Manyike 00:38:49
You thought you’re just entering mahala mona?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:38:50
No, but now she’s pregnant and she knew that at Pirates, the funny part at Pirates, I was the only one without a child. They would tease me, Go to your house with it’s fridges and microwave ovens , because I didn’t have a child. But It didn’t hurt at the time. But like ok, I’ll have a child. Then the child came at the wrong time in my life. I said that I’d do the best that I can with whatever that’s left. I took my girlfriend to Medi-Clinic. My child was born at Medi-Clinic when I wasn’t working.
John Manyike 00:39:34
So there was no more income at that time?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:39:35
There was no more income, but I had saved up there and there and I had spent like over fifty over sixty for my child. My child was born in the morning at 08am and the day before I was high from the morning. My child was supposed to be born two days later but came two days earlier. So they called me and I went there. So when I held him, everything changed. (40:11 JM: That’s when you realized, there’s no need to take your life?) No need to take my life, but I’m not saying that was going to stop drugs now, no. but I said like let me just try to be the best because of my parents, they raised me well man, they tried. They raised me well.
John Manyike 00:40:31
So when the funds dried, how are you surviving until now?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:40:32
Because, this thing, it happens in another way. I don’t know, now the funds are dry, people still know it’s Bibo. I’ll call, maybe I’ll call maybe your Dino Ndlovu, I’ll call your Tumi Stopnonsons. Hey man, please assist me with this amount, I need to do something, they believed me. They thought that I just need to do something with the money. They don’t know where the money goes, you know? I had friends who had money, would send me money you know. In 10 it’s gone. At home, they are like Thandani man, you shut them out. Sometimes they come all the way from Free State and I don’t open the gate. Imagine.
John Manyike 00:40:21
So your family will come all the way from Free State, get to Fourways and you don’t open the gate for them.
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:41:25
I don’t open the gate for them, or I switch off my phone. I changed numbers, maybe I changed numbers almost 20 times.
John Manyike 00:41:30
You don’t want to talk to them? But is it the shame or disappointment?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:41:34
It’s shame, it’s all. I don’t know what I can call it. All the English words, I don’t know. I don’t know if it’s shame or what and then I’m stranded. I’m like, you know sometimes I’m like let me drink or whatever like so your parents also are trying too, but like I’m saying, I don’t want to go to rehab because I’m not a junkie.
John Manyike 00:42:07
You’re not admitting that.
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:42:08
I’m not admitting that I’ve got a problem so now you start drinking because you’re trying to substitute, sometimes you’re trying to forget and you can’t forget these things. Now, I’m sitting inside the house, I chased out the mother of my child, I want to be alone here you see? So this childhood friend of mine, Pule. My mother said to him, You’re going there and you’re going to go in. he wont chase you away. You’ll stay with him and watch him. And my friend left his job, he was working ko Sasol or something, left his job after being sent by my parents to watch over me of what I mustn’t do. Like it pained me. Imagine that guy is there to watch over me, sometimes we’d fight, sometimes you see? But, and then I said like ok, then this opportunity of that I can go back to football, you see?
John Manyike 00:43:17
After the ban? That was reduced from 4 years to 2 years now?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:43:18
After the ban. It was 4 years. Then I thought that it was done. Done, done. I started to gain weight. (43:29 JM: O ne o le Bibo) I was Bibo like yerrr! And then even the mind, you think you’re ok also for me, because I was still staying in Fourways in my house that I bought when I was still in a comfort zone nyana, I still have a house, that’s what made me think I’m ok. Still staying in your house. Then, this guy I went to school with, Mpho Sethaba, we went to Kamohelo’s house, Mokotjo, we’re drinking, he was from Europe. We’re drinking, then he’s like, You know you can still go back? We went to school with this guy. We called him Lemphane he wasn’t very good in soccer but good academically. He said ‘You know I can win this case?’ And when you’re drunk you just talk about anything. ‘You can win this case!’ I said, you see now you’re drunk. He told me that he’d come to my house the following day. My parents were there, they had come to see me for a little bit but I had left them in the house and went to Kamo. This guy says he can win the case, I didn’t believe him. He drove me back home, we’re all drunk telling my father that he could win the case. At that time, your child just lost his job because of drugs, on the other hand you come to the house drunk, then you’re telling him that you’re gonna win the case? Never! Kanti, he’s the person who’s going to win the case for me, then they cut the thing from 4 years to 2 years. If I waited, you know that thing when they tell you like when it happened and you waited for 4 years then you going to sue, saying because its cocaine, recreational drugs, there’s no one who was banned…It didn’t happen that way.
Then now you want to go back to soccer now? Bibo, I’m this big. The ban is finished. But I’m behaving like, I’m still behaving like the old Bibo. but now you have this thing like let me prove people wrong now. It’s the mind. You can’t tell it one thing and not do the right thing. Gavin Hunt, the one that called me. Hes like come and train. I train. Then I started to be positive again. Then I stopped like, the drugs. Trained with coach Gavin, train, trained. Like my mentality comes back. I’m like yeh? Like this thing is possible. Coach Gavin knew, I was about to sign with Wits so now back to fitness. But I’m still drinking. Sometimes there and there I still go and take, you understand? Then coach Gavin knew that Wits is gonna, they’re gonna sell Wits. He’s like no, I don’t think we’re going to sign you. Then coach Mphahlele, not coach, the boss. Baroka boss, called me. He said ‘Don’t you want to play for me ko Baroka?’ I was like yeah, I want to play. But I know, my mind hayi, I can’t even give you twenty minutes. How I play? I can’t even run, but the football brains are there. You can trap, you can pass. But the intensity, you need to train extra hard for people that, I was out for almost two years. Then these guys are like, I’ll give you what they were giving you at Pirates.
John Manyike 00:47:15
What?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:47:15
That’s when I googled his name. (47:17 JM: Is waar) Who is this man? I see this guy has a sponsor at global what, what. Then I told my girlfriend, the child was born that time, let me go there for 4 month earn a little bit then leave. In my mind I know I wont play. I get there. But it was nice like they all respect me, the guys there. So now they calling me Grootman, then you see my time is up. Grootman? (47:44 JM: Once they start calling you Grootman, its over)
Now there’s this situation now, we have to leave our phones when we go to camp if we play Saturday. We go to camp on Thursday, we’re playing on Saturday. So I come maybe on Thursday, we give phones on Thursday, I have a small baby. And I said no never, I’ll never give you my phone. At home, the gate is opened with my phone. No Ntshumayelo don’t come with the attitudes of Pirates, I’m like no chairman with respect. We’re like talking and I’m showing him the reasons you see? Its here, use it and put it back. Sometimes I don’t put the phone back you see and it caused a fight with them. Sometimes we lose, I’m the one with the phone and now I’m to blame, and I’m like I didn’t play. I didn’t play but it was nice it was a different experience, from academy, now wash your own things there. I stay in a little room there, after training you have to wash your training kit. I came from the academy, since 15 I’ve never washed my own kit. No.
John Manyike 00:48:56
So let me conclude. There are a lot of young players including those who are aspiring to get into the soccer space. When it comes to handling finances, what would you say to them?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:49:14
There’s three things I’m gonna say. Number 1, It’s up to you. Its up to you. We can bring a hundred financial advisors. If you don’t want to, you don’t want to. Number 2. Respect money and respect what brings that money. Whether it’s a side hustle, I’m talking to young kids in general growing up. Whether it’s a side hustle, as long as it brings money to look after you, you need to respect that. Like just respect it. You’ll see what its gonna do for you. If you respect money, I’ve seen after. If you respect that two hundred that you have, I’m telling you, chances of you being. Happiness is not having a lot of money. Its being able to sustain yourself. You will see. That’s the advice I’m going to give. Its up to you. But go get financial advisors. They will help you they wen to school for that. Theres a lot of things, they’ll show you how to save money, like do those things. Le rona they told us but we never. We’ve been there for long.
John Manyike 00:50:44
So right now, how are you surviving? How are you making income now?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:50:48
Now, I sold my house, I sold my house the one I had. (50:54 JM: It has history hey?) Yeah, I looked after that house. I sold it. And then we sat down with my father and I’m building another one now. I don’t have a stable job, but I’m back home. But I’m doing coaching. Its things that take process, but I’m happy with the progress. I went. After that I went for therapy and I think, I think I’m happy with the steps that I’m taking in my life ja.
John Manyike 00:51:26
So you stay with your mother and father?
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:51:27
No, I’m back home, I’m back to Free State, but I’m travelling everytime to, because I’m building a house. So I come to check. And things like when I’m called, I’m open to have one that needs my advice. The little advice, experience that I have and I will share with anyone. So that’s the thing. Sometimes I’ll go somewhere we play, or I give talks and make money. But I don’t have a standard charge, that I’m charging this much, no. you know that I have needs, you know that I have to look after my family, so I go there and talk to them. Then you go forward.
John Manyike 00:52:06
You must be proud though that you invested in your fathers education. He’s a doctor today.
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:52:09
But I didn’t even do it because he was my father, I didn’t even think like that. Honest to God, I didn’t even think like that. Like look at him know. (52:19 JM: He was a visionary) Look at what he’s doing with his life. Look now, he has given me my dignity back in the community because he has hidden my shame.
[00:52:32] JOHN MANYIKE:
John Manyike 00:52:32
Anyway I don’t know whether to say Bibo or what but Thandani, but thank you for coming, thank you for joining. Thank you for sharing your life journey with us. I’m sure a lot of people will learn from it, get inspired from it and it can help us improve our lives. And I wish you all the best for your future.
Thandani Ntshumayelo 00:52:52
Thank you so much for inviting me and I’d like to say to you and your team, I’d like to thank you guys for the way that you asked questions. It shows that you have, I don’t know if I can say, botho, and you have respect for a person regardless of what they’ve done. Like that, I wish, a lot of podcasts and things that we go through we must remember respect the person you’re talking to. No matter what they’ve done. Because it goes a long way. You never know where you’re going to meet tomorrow. Thank you for the team for welcoming me, I wish you guys all the best. Thank you for having me.
John Manyike 00:53:42
Thank you very much.